Coming Out As a Human: A Response to the Huffington Post’s “Gay Priest”

At first I thought Father Gary Meier’s recent article at HuffPo, where he comes out as a gay Catholic priest, was just the usual narcissistic twaddle: damaging and scandalous, certainly, but forgivable enough for someone who’s been taught to think foggily and use words carelessly.

It’s now commonplace, for example, to use “love” in so vague a way that it could mean anything at all — so it’s not shocking that Fr. Meier believes that “to love as God created you to love” could ever involve using your reproductive organs in a way entirely contrary to the purpose for which they were created.

It’s strange, but wouldn’t raise too many eyebrows anymore, to call homosexuality “a life-giving gift” — even though homosexual sex is, by its nature, both barren and destructive. Any behavior which involves such a high probability of physical damage to both partners, and exactly zero chance of procreation, can hardly be called “life-giving.”

It’s confusing, but not surprising, when he talks about Catholics being “denied the sacraments….because of who they love.” Does he mean “love” in the Christian sense? Obviously not, since all are called to love all. Does he mean “love” in the sexual sense? A priest should certainly deny Communion to any publicly unrepentant fornicator, whether heterosexual or homosexual. Does he mean “love” in the romantic sense? I’ve never heard of anyone being denied Communion simply because he felt one way or another.

Indeed it is unclear not only what Fr. Meier is talking about, but whom. If there is any priest who’s denied Communion to a person simply because that person was attracted to the same gender, that would be a scandal indeed; but I’ve heard of no such instance, and if Fr. Meier has, he’s not telling.

All these are fairly standard forms of fuzziness. They show no ill will on Fr. Meier’s part. They only show that he is in the habit of taking counsel from the prevailing zeitgeist instead of from the wisdom of the Church, and that this habit has corroded his ability to think clearly.

What is truly offensive, though, is his apparent belief that some conditions are inherently shameful. Read this passage carefully:

It’s hard enough to be a “straight” teenager dealing with the standard ups and downs of hormones and emotions, but to be a teenager with same-sex attractions in a community where your spiritual leaders, the people you look to for guidance and affirmation, are telling you that you have a disease like alcoholism…Can anyone survive it intact? Yet that’s precisely the message our Church is sharing. LGBT youth are hearing that they are disordered, diseased, defective, damaged goods, wrong when they should be right.

Why bring up alcoholism? Because alcoholism is a truly icky disease? Because any teenager who is an alcoholic should consider himself “damaged goods”?

If we follow Fr. Meier’s logic to its end, we are forced to conclude one of two things: either that some diseases (such as alcoholism) are and should be causes for shame — or that there is no such thing as a disease.

The truly Christian point of view is not that none of us are sinful, diseased, or damaged, but that all of us are. We are called to love damaged people — that is to say, everyone — not by pretending that disease is health, but by recognizing that the damaged person is not identified with his damage.

So we love people who commit adultery, but we don’t call their adultery “one of the infinite ways God’s love can be manifested in our world,” and we don’t stop at identifying them as Adulterers. We love people who are chronically tempted to abuse alcohol, but we don’t tell them that their alcoholism is “a life-giving gift,” and we don’t stop at identifying them as Alcoholics.

The last time I called myself a homosexual, my spiritual director asked me: Are you in a romantic or sexual relationship with another man? Do you visit gay bars or bathhouses? Do you habitually view gay pornography? Do you purposely indulge in gay fantasies? Since the answer to every question was “No,” he replied: “Then I’m sorry to tell you, Steve — as a homosexual, you’re a terrible failure.”

I hope Father Meier is a terrible failure as a homosexual, too. I hope he honors his vow of chastity, even if he has ceased to honor the Magisterium. I hope he has people in his life who love him enough that they will not permit him to reduce his identity to a set of urges.

And I hope he learns one day that to be damaged, whether by homosexuality or alcoholism or depression or any other disorder, is not to be diminished in dignity. It is to be human.

 

Cover image credit: shutterstock.com

Joseph Prever

By

Joseph Prever graduated from the Thomas More College of Liberal Arts with a bachelor's degree in English and a penchant for romantic existentialism. He now lives in Massachusetts, where he works as a web developer and freelance writer. He blogs at gaycatholic.com, under the semi-pseudonym of Steve Gershom, about issues of faith, sexuality, and mental health. Michael Chabon is his favorite living author, and Dostoevsky is his favorite dead one.

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  • http://www.facebook.com/maria.rowse Maria Rowse

    Well written…your words are theologically based. I will pray for all priests who battle homosexual life patterns.
    Personally, I do not believe that practicing homosexuals should be ordained or married. A sin is a sin.

  • GregCz

    The hoolywood sub culture and liberals have many people especially children believing that homosexuality is ok and many think that they’re gay, only to realize that they’re being sucked into this immoral lifestyle to further advance the gay agenda. In reality most of these individuals are not gay but practice the immoral sex that the gay movement promotes.

  • stevegershom

    Whut? So, some men sleep with other men, not because they have any particular desire to, but because the gay movement tells them to?

  • Irksome1

    There’s an assumed premise here that when Father Meier talks about “homosexuals” being denied the sacraments that Mr. Gershom goes on to assume he MUST mean the Eucharist. I don’t see why that is and note that among the sacraments the Eucharist is LEAST likely to be denied even to notorious public sinners at odds with the Magisterium (Biden, Pelosi, Clinton, Hannity, etc.). Just in my own circle of friends, I can point to specific instances of people being denied baptism, absolution, marriage (to a member of the opposite sex), Holy Orders and even extreme unction. This even segues neatly with Mr. Gershom’s observation regarding communion since the same bigot who is too cowardly to risk a scene at a Mass in public might well feel free to indulge his prejudice over a phone or behind closed doors.

  • stevegershom

    There are situations in which it is not only legitimate but necessary to deny any of the sacraments to a given person. Without knowing more about the situations you mention, though, I can’t tell whether the priest or priests in question were acting according to bigotry, or simply orthodoxy.

  • Flower_Mom

    Steve is correct; can’t comment without knowing the specifics of above cited celebrities. I would wonder, though, why be concerned about those celebs and their state/nonstate of sinfulness? Ultimately, each is responsible for his/her own choices — even the priests giving/denying the sacraments, That goes for ALL of us. It’s YOUR choice to engage/not engage in sinful behavior, so perhaps focusing on yourself is a better use of your time.

  • Robbe Sebesta

    Wow, this is really good, and I thank you for your wisdom.

  • Irksome1

    I won’t deny that legitimate reasons may exist to deny access to the sacraments to some individuals under certain conditions. However, wouldn’t it be reasonable for a person experiencing same-sex attractions to notice, given my list of public persons above, that those legitimate reasons only seem broad enough to capture those like himself and therefore conclude that what this really is is an excuse to deny an undesirable the Grace of God?

  • Irksome1

    Taken to its logical end, this ethic of leaving everyone to be responsible for his own sins would, in effect, mean it is unjust to deny the sacraments for any reason since the individual receiving them and he alone, would be responsible for the consequences. Like Cain, we would deny the obligation to be our brothers’ keeper.

  • stevegershom

    I guess if that ever happened, then yeah. Did it, that you know of? Do you know of anybody being denied access to any sacrament just because of same-sex attraction?

  • Irksome1

    I do know of this happening both through direct experience and, as mentioned above, the testimony of friends I trust. Granted, I don’t know the frequency with which this happens, but that’s not the point. The point is that Fr. Meier is right: it happens. Also, when it happens, the victim is put into an impossible situation where, even if he can summon the courage to air for public scrutiny the contents of what often happened in private, the first thing he can look forward to is not redress, but a list of rationalizations about why the priest in question was right to do it (and before I’m asked, I’ve got experience with THAT as well). Under those circumstances, can’t we at least admit to the possibility that Fr. Meier raises a legitimate concern?

  • Richard III

    Very true. But we have to wonder if Fr. Meier had told anyone or even if he’d “realized” or decided he was same-sex attracted before his ordination.

  • stevegershom

    So, in the direct experience you mentioned, was the person denied a sacrament because he/she was same-sex attracted, or because he/she was known to be in the habit of unrepentantly acting on those attractions?

  • Irksome1

    In the direct experience I mentioned, the individual was unknown to the priest. There was no public knowledge of his having acted upon his inclinations at all, let alone unrepentantly. What there was, simply, an admission of guilt before God in His sacrament, and a request for forgiveness that was denied without even the courtesy of a follow-up question. Again, this happens.

  • Gallibus

    Personally, I have discovered that there are many who should not be allowed to marry never mind becoming priests – because of their emotional incapacity or sheer twistedness – they become the source of incredible pain and suffering for their often initially unsuspecting partners. It would be good if there was a way of diagnosing and ‘fixing’ these people before letting them loose on the unsuspecting. But I suppose this is life and evil is one of the tools that humble us and rub off the rough edges.

  • stevegershom

    Still confused — what sacrament are we talking about? What was the guilt that was admitted? When you say “forgiveness was denied”, do you mean a priest refused absolution to someone, or are we talking about something else?

  • andrea gregorio

    Yawn…. Yet another piece of fulminating homophobia. As a fact-based, piece of intellectual critique I give it zero out of 10. I suspect that the truly magnificent strides in equality we are now seeing across all of the civilised world have directly precipitated this sort of sour, vile and unholy rant. I am surprised that the NCR is prepared to publish such laughable twaddle. If the author has the cognitive ability to do so (and that is certainly in doubt reading the above) then he should reflect on the likelihood that homosexuality is part of Nature’s inbuilt population control and that it is therefore fully part of the Natural Order. The author will, of course, have no option but to retreat into the shadows, muttering away to himself as Society implements full equality and legal recognition and protection under the Law. Increasingly, opions such as his are of interest only to himself.

  • stevegershom

    I’m sure you don’t mean that all men and women with ssa are “sheerly twisted” or “emotionally incapacitated” or should all be lumped together under the banner of “these people” who need “fixing”.

    That isn’t what you mean, is it? I’m sure it isn’t.

  • stevegershom

    Ooh! You used my word, “twaddle”! I like that word too.

    Mutter, mutter, mutter. Look at me muttering in the shadows.

  • stevegershom

    Foggy thinking, by the way. Your unstated premise is that if something is part of What Nature Does, then it is moral for human beings to do it.

    It could just as easily be argued that miscarriages are part of the Natural Order as a means of population control, so that therefore abortion must be okay, since it’s basically the same thing.

    But I wouldn’t say such a thing, because it would be horrible and unreasonable.

  • Irksome1

    The sacrament was Reconciliation and it was absolution that was denied. Moreover, if you want more details, I hope you’ll understand my declining to provide them here, though I’d happily give them to you privately.

  • stevegershom

    Yes, I understand your prudence! I guess my only point is that, sure, there are some instances where a priest not only can but should deny absolution. I don’t know whether this was one of those instances. If you want to continue the conversation by email, please feel free — my email address is on my blog, linked above.

  • sophie73

    Amazingly good post! At last some sane logical piece! Thank you.

  • J D

    All sodomites are mentally ill and should be removed from society much the same way we do any aberrant or criminal mind. Homophiles are the co-dependents of sodomites and should be treated as any co-dependents. Some sodomites are victims of rape or poor, or non-existent, same-sex parenting, but some, as Scripture indicates, may be guilty of a super-abundant pride, that gives them over to worshiping the creature over the CREATOR!

  • stevegershom

    Oh dear. Yes, let’s toss them ALL in prison! Or maybe burn them at the stake.

    Actually, why stop with them? Let’s remove from society all those who sin in any way! Except for people who sin in ways we like, of course.

  • Jacques DUMON

    In some parts of the showbiz industry, where gay people are many, it is not unusual that heterosexual men accept to share a bed with gay ones to get a promotion. Only the first time is hard…

  • stevegershom

    I’m sure that happens, but I’m sure it doesn’t apply to “most of these individuals”, as GregCz was claiming. Actually, I’m not even sure he was referring to. Most gay people? Most hollywood people? Most liberals?

  • Jacques DUMON

    I don’t share your opinion: A priest who KNOWINGLY gives the communion to an unrepentant person in state of mortal sin, or excommunicated or publicly supporting abortion and gay marriage partakes in a desecration of the true Body of Christ and in the eternal damnation of that person.

  • Jacques DUMON

    “inbuilt population control” ? Wow. And “fully part of the Natural Order”. You write the 2 last words with capital initial letters, thus meaning, and you are right, that the Natural Order is part of God’s Creation.
    So you are brilliantly demonstrating that God truly intended homosexuality to be part of His creation, in contradiction with the Bible’s Genesis: “He created them male and female, and He saw that this was good”…
    Pure blasphemy from your part…

  • Brian Gerard Dempski

    Hi Steve,

    I find your thoughts interesting. Thank you for sharing! I have a long healing and spiritual journey myself (different, but also coming from a wounded background), but am wondering why you label yourself as “Catholic, GAY [my emphasis], and Feeling Fine, Thanks”, especially if you aren’t practicing? Temptations, however large or small, don’t make a person a “adulterer, homosexual, thieve, greedy, drunkard”. You can probably tell that I am coming from the position that I don’t believe people are born “gay” as there is no evidence for it. I have heard of at least one man and one woman who got married after experiencing same sex attraction (and also a friend of mine who is a Christian who is now married) and now are happily married and growing in their Catholic faith. It seems to label oneself sometimes puts the self in sort of bondage, as if there is no true hope for healing sexual attraction in Christ. Also, some people struggling with same sex attraction are against Reparative Therapy – Narth.com. Not sure why… why not be open for such hope to heal the soul? I think to say I AM “THIS” is why some people struggle with suicide, because they loose hope, same could be true for those with same sex attraction.

    You mentioned:
    “but by recognizing that the damaged person is not identified with his damage.”

    Paul says, “And such were some of you.” How do you see that verse? I don’t believe the “such were” isn’t the stopping of a given behavior, but the healing and transformation of the heart from the inside out, the heart being rightly ordered towards God. I am not saying this healing is an overnight thing, and a person might never be fully healed, but what does being fully healed look like in this world? The married “heterosexual” still might struggle with lust for another woman from time to time.

    “Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.” (1 Corinthians 6:9-11)

    Thank you for the discussion. If you want to email me or find me on facebook, Brian Dempski. God Bless You! Thanks for your thoughts!

  • stevegershom

    Thanks, Brian, I appreciate the feedback. I think the jury is still out on what, if any, degree of change in orientation is possible, but I have an open mind. In any case, I think that if it is possible, it’s not possible for all who experience SSA.

    As for why I sometimes use the word “gay”, I have a little bit about that in my Q&A section:

    http://www.stevegershom.com/about/

    Peace,
    SG

  • LO

    How can someone who is so filled with hatred also think of themselves as Christian? It seems to me that you’ve altogether missed the message of the CREATOR to love one another.

  • stevegershom

    Let me just say that, having heard privately from Irksome1, he is 100% right! He experienced a situation in which a priest’s actions were dictated by ugly, horrendous bigotry.

    I’m so sorry, Irksome1, that you went through it, and I’m sorry for pushing you hard about it. I pushed hard because people can sometimes be too quick to cry “bigotry”, but that isn’t the case with you.

  • Irksome1

    I am unaware of having held differently.

  • Chris L

    No matter how its worded, sugarcoated, or attempts at redefining authentic sexuality, the pseudo-sexuality that is prevalent in today’s society will never bring true happiness to those who choose to engage in it. Lust kills love.

  • catholicexchange

    Yes, we, the staff of CE, were just about to hit the big “Delete” button for JD’s comment, but then Mr. Gershom’s response would not be as much fun. God bless.

  • Deoacveritatimyfaithsustainsm

    You’re SICK!!!

  • QuoVadisAnima

    And like Cain, she asks “Am I my brother’s keeper?”… God’s implicit answer was yes, btw…

  • Straight sinner

    Amen my brother.

  • pnyikos

    Andrea, I believe you are exactly as insincere–no more and no less–as J D, whose rant is diametrically opposite yours.

    I believe you will agree publicly with this assessment, and pretend to believe that J D actually expresses what all of us traditional Christians believe, but are afraid to say.

    Either that, or you will simply disappear, because you have accomplished what you set out to do, which was simply to generate some responses which amuse you.

  • pnyikos

    Well put, Steve. I might add that for people living in communes, the same “logic” says it would be perfectly OK for the “top dogs” in the commune to kill all the babies born to “underdogs” because that is what happens in the wild dog packs of Africa.

  • John Paul

    I have a feeling that at this point in your spiritual development you are held more culpable for your callousness and hypocrisy than would a homosexual falling into a sin of weakness. As Jesus pointed out to the pharisees, “These will enter the kingdom of heaven before you. You do not go in yourselves nor do you let others enter. Blind guides! You strain out a gnat and swallow a camel. You bow to the letter of the law and violate the HEART of the law: justice, mercy, and faith. How can you hypocrites escape damnation? You are clean enough without, but WITHIN full of dead mens bones and all corruption!” Jesus would not banish the sinners from his presence as the pharisees did, (and as you suggest by advising to banish sodomites from society). It’s not His way and you know that. Jesus told the disciples when they pleaded with him not to enter the house of a sinner, “It is the sick who need the doctor.” Referring to the adulterous woman who washed his feet with her tears and dried them with her hair, “He loves much who has much to be forgiven.” You had better be careful, JD. Our Lord has warned us that “the judgements you measure out are the ones you will receive,” and again,”How can you see clear to take a splinter from your brothers eye when there is a plank in your own!” Show mercy, JD and admonish your brothers with love.

  • pnyikos

    You did right to push him, Steve; your only mistake, if any, was not to offer one or two steps earlier to continue the discussion privately.

    Not knowing the details like you do, I can only add a general comment: the old form of the Act of Contrition ends with the words, “I firmly resolve, with the help of Thy grace, to sin no more and to avoid the near occasions of sin. Amen.” If a sinner clearly indicates the lack of such a firm resolve in the confessional, then I believe the priest would be correct in denying absolution.

  • pnyikos

    Steve, yours is one of the best essays I have ever read on this touchy subject. I have also come to appreciate the depth of your first contribution to CE when it inaugurated its new “tabloid” style.

    In that contribution, you stressed that your same-sex attraction is not something that defines you as a person, the way some radical gays would have people think. I did not realize the depth to which this radical idea is pushed until I saw a film on TV in New Zealand, on a public channel.

    It depicted a Maori who was married and had a son and daughter, and who was cheating on his wife with a gay man. When the wife came to suspect, by his absences and his renting an apartment that he was having an affair, she was ready to forgive and forget and try to make their marriage work — until she found out that the lover was male. Then she displayed what even I would call “homophobia”, as did the parents of this Maori.

    The main character struggled with his attraction for a while, and then announced that he was no longer going to try to make his marriage work, despite the fact that his daughter was only about 6 years old, because “that would be living a lie. I am gay.” [or words to that effect]

    Then there came a kind of standard Hollywood scene, in which his daughter ran out into the rocks that went far out from the shore where they were staying, and the whole family was frantic with anxiety because they were afraid she might be swept out by a high wave and drown. It was dark, but her father called frantically to her and found her.

    Well, that takes care of it, I thought; her father now realizes how much his family means to him, and he to them.

    But no, the final scene, which came almost immediately after this climactic one, shows her father having moved permanently into an apartment, and his own father saying he’s reconciled himself to the fact that his son is gay, and saying the rest of the family (including the man’s wife) will eventually understand too. Evidently, gayness trumped all obligations this man had for being a responsible parent.

    With that kind of propaganda permeating the culture, it is small wonder that New Zealand, which already had same-sex marriage (except in name) in the form of its liberal civil union laws, recently “baptized” those unions by legally calling them “marriages”. All the campaigning of the bishops of New Zealand went for naught.

  • Etnaner McRondi

    I need to know what you think, so I can share them the next time I’m asked the following question:

    If the answer to the following questions…

    Are you in a romantic or sexual relationship with another man? Do you visit gay bars or bathhouses? Do you habitually view gay pornography? Do you purposely indulge in gay fantasies?

    …is NO, then what made you think you’re homosexual?

  • pnyikos

    Brian, I used to have the same attitude you do towards the word “gay” being used for homosexuals, but now I’ve resigned myself to the way the traditional meaning of the word seems to be going extinct. A generation or two from now, children may no longer know what the “Flintstones” theme song means by “We’ll have a gay old time.”

    My current attitude towards the word is a paraphrasal of something Bagheera sarcastically says in The Jungle Book. With the Gay Power movement in mind, I think: “Ye have fought for the word “gay,” and it is yours. Eat it, wolves.”

  • irishsmile

    Does this “priest” still enjoy official faculties within his diocese? If so, why? His personal sins are his own but his little money-making book is a scandal. The Vatican has been very clear regarding denial of admission to seminaries of men who are gay/homosexual.

  • J D

    It’s like a HOMOPHILE BATH-HOUSE IN HERE! Look up what OUR LADY OF LASALLLETTE says about the spirit of asmodeus infecting the Church. Do all you homophiles keep gerbils for your sodomite friends when they visit? You DELETE because you can’t answer without resorting to lavender-gestapo tactics! Be effeminate cowards if you wish! Like all your heroes in the Heirarcchy!

    SALVE REGINA, MATER MISERICORDIA, ORA PRO NOBIS!

  • stevegershom

    In a nutshell, this:

    * I find men physically and sexually attractive, which is not the case (or is the case to a very small degree) with women

    * I have a strong desire for emotional intimacy with men, which is not the case with women

    That’s about it. Does that qualify me?

  • stevegershom

    I cry troll. Seriously, nobody spells that badly.

  • Brian Gerard Dempski

    Have you looked into the Father wound or other past wounds, Steve? It seems some of the men that I know that struggle with SSA have a hard time processing their past wounds.

  • stevegershom

    Yes, indeed. I’ve written a bit about that stuff on my blog, so I won’t try to sum it up here.

  • Paul

    There is nothing holy, moral or righteous about homosexual behavior. It is not in God’s plan and one can never validate such behavior by equal rights arguments or PC arguments. Truth demands that we detest your deviant, uncontrollable sexual desires but truth also demands that we love you as the sinner you are. Any homosexual priest must be excommunicated

  • stevegershom

    I have three words for you, Paul: herpa derp derp.

  • Molly

    I think this might be the best com box reply ever.

  • Brian Gerard Dempski

    Hi,

    It isn’t so much about word usage as it has to do with the how I believe people are deceived into believing a lie regarding their sexuality and resign to giving up hope for marriage (only one type of marriage). Any label can have consequences insofar as the person who is being labeled puts that label before their relationship with God. God tells us who and Whose we are.

    I don’t recall that movie or the context.

  • Brian Gerard Dempski

    Thank you for the link, Steve. God is good and faithful! I have been around different people who struggle with SSA to various degrees (or have watched same sex pornography without physically acting out with another person of the same sex); one is now happily married, one is single, another is single and only watched same sex porn and says is not attracted to same sex. ALL three of them had (or has) opposite sex sexual relations. I also have read two different Catholic testimonies by two different people now happily married. It is interesting both had encounters with Blessed Mother Mary. I believe Blessed Mother heals people through her blessed prayers!

    So it surely is possible to either be happily married with SSA (with various degrees of healing) or to remain celibate and single. That probably isn’t all new information for you. I want to encourage you to continue to pray that God’s will be done for your life. Sometimes (most times it seems!) we don’t know His plans for us. I am glad that you are continuing to seek holiness. It is encouraging to read.

    God Bless You!

    Brian

  • dagor_annon

    Either you are speaking from experience, and have experienced ‘being converted to gay’, or you are so full of $#!% it’s not even funny.

    Seriously – a VAST majority of people could not comprehend being ‘converted’ or ‘choosing’ to be attracted to a different sex than they are already. What makes you think that it actually happens?

    Yours is either a special kind of stupidity, or a disingenuousness that is an affront to moral communication.

  • dagor_annon

    Wouldn’t it be a blessing if the man in the movie hadn’t felt that marrying a woman and having a child was the only solution? Instead of forcing (against his natural attractions) himself to try to cleave to a wife, perhaps he could have spared everyone the pain, and been honest to begin with.

    Perhaps another look at what fruitfulness can be would help you to re-organize your thoughts on gay marriage.

    There is fruit, good fruit, available from gay marriage. In Castii Connubi are the foundations for a new understanding of marriage, one that recognizes the variation among people, and doesn’t stick to the ‘fertility religion’ roots of RCC. Castii Connubi also has large parts that are worried about contraception et al., but at least look at what the CHIEF reason and purpose of matrimony may be.

    Here’s the clip from Castii Connubii:
    24. This MUTUAL MOLDING of husband and wife, this determined effort to perfect each other, can in a VERY REAL sense, as the Roman Catechism teaches, be said to be the CHIEF reason and purpose of matrimony, provided matrimony be looked at not in the RESTRICTED sense as instituted for the proper conception and education of the child, but more widely as the blending of life as a whole and mutual interchange and sharing thereof.

  • dagor_annon

    What kind of God do you believe in? How can perfection be lessened?

    Explain it to me like I am uninformed about how God works:

    1st: How does a person coming in contact with an infinitely good God lessen that person or God, no matter their state?

    2nd: Even if a priest has the knowledge that someone has, at one point, been in a state of mortal sin, how are they to know the person has not repented?

  • dagor_annon

    Homosexual behavior is not in God’s plan? A demonstrable physical reaction exists, but God does not intend for those with that reaction to act on it? It beggars the imagination to think that God has created humans as (among other things) sexual creatures, and intends for a good percentage of them not to be physically sexual.

    Why did God make so many gays?
    If he didn’t make them, how do they come about? Seriously, if he didn’t make them, who chose to be gay? Could you chose to be gay? If so, CONGRATULATIONS, you are either gay or bi-sexual.

  • dagor_annon

    Blasphemy. What a word.

    We see God in his creation. If you observe his creation, deny the reality of part of it because you don’t want to see it… you are blaspheming.

    If you take a modern orthodox Catholic Thomistic understanding of sexuality – you take a position that gay sex is bad because it takes place outside of marriage. Sex is good because it is unitive, but gay sex is bad because it breaks up marriages, and gays can’t get married because gay sex is bad.

    Just to troll for a second: if that quote from Genesis means that it is blasphemy to say that homosexuality is okay… Wait until I tell you about the lightbulb, with which I create light where God had separated out the darkness.

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